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This is likely a long shot, but it doesn't hurt to post. I'd like to hike Brown's Cave on Dec 7th which is a Sunday. This is a great hike that will be in peak Autumn foliage (darn near the latest stand in the continental US) at it's destination. My last hike four years ago was cut short as Fritzski had to return to his family. I'd like to venture down just a tad bit further to the lake. The hike is mildly strenuous but nothing overwhelming.

The catch: my new(4th ) Tacoma isn't 4x4 so this is all dependant on somebody joining with a beasty 4x4. The road in is horrid and will seriously scratch the paint on your truck. It's kind of equivalent to 5 large steps (similar to the one Tortilla step) and several rough in between miles. The shrubbery that can only be topped by the horrid drive around South Butte. This is an all day adventure from about 3am to 7-8pm. Gee! any takers

As a 4x4 thrasher myself this looks interesting....... both the drive AND the hike.
But I thought that potentially a pontoon boat rental from Apache Lake Marina might also be an optional access vehicle, and allow more 4x4-less participation. It's likely about 5 (lake) miles from the marina to the mouth of Alder. The Lake-Brown's Cave-Adam's Camp-Long Canyon-Lake loop looks to be less than 7 miles (although on-the-ground miles could be a bit longer) The pontoon rates are (I think) $175 per day - $225 per 24 hours. Even with gas added it would run about $25. per if there were 10 people and that would be for 24 hours - the 24 hour option allows an overnight lakeside campout. (and, as a pontoon has substantial storage areas, cold beer might be worthy reward after the hike and/or at the camp.)
Just a thought.

hikeaz wrote: It's likely about 5 (lake) miles from the marina to the mouth of Alder.

Just FYI.. here is a good pic from one of Joe's previous trips in this general area showing all the lake detail: http://hikearizona.com/phoZOOM.php?ZIP=13199

hikeaz wrote:As a 4x4 thrasher myself this looks interesting....... both the drive AND the hike.
But I thought that potentially a pontoon boat rental from Apache Lake Marina might also be an optional access vehicle, and allow more 4x4-less participation. It's likely about 5 (lake) miles from the marina to the mouth of Alder. The Lake-Brown's Cave-Adam's Camp-Long Canyon-Lake loop looks to be less than 7 miles (although on-the-ground miles could be a bit longer) The pontoon rates are (I think) $175 per day - $225 per 24 hours. Even with gas added it would run about $25. per if there were 10 people and that would be for 24 hours - the 24 hour option allows an overnight lakeside campout. (and, as a pontoon has substantial storage areas, cold beer might be worthy reward after the hike and/or at the camp.)
Just a thought.

Brilliant, count me in for that idea

hikeaz wrote:pontoon boat rental from Apache Lake Marina

Hmmmm. Sounds fun, especially the after hike beer. But being 4x4 fan myself, driving looks to be part of the adventure IMHO. But then again majority rules and I'm easily swayed.

I'm in and out to enjoy the hike on a very limited schedule. This is one of the most exquisite and rarely travelled journeys close to the valley. Mules, helicopters and boats aren't my style.

Nevertheless, hope anybody can make it however they want to go! Will probably be looping(if possible) around the lake area in the 10-2 vicinity.

Hank and I will know more about the road in the up coming week.

Just beefing up on my knowledge before committing to an all dayer.
So it looks like a good 13mi of dirt until Cane Spring and another 2 until the map goes into Pack Trail mode?
Brown's Cave- just a landmark or a bring flashlighter?

Doh! Family is in town that weekend, oh well

te-wa wrote:if that is a typical road, i should have no trouble with it. montero has limited slip rear w/ 32's on a 2" lift
im on the interested list for now..

i have seen the montero struggle, make sure you bring a tow strap

skatchkins wrote:Just beefing up on my knowledge before committing to an all dayer.
So it looks like a good 13mi of dirt until Cane Spring and another 2 until the map goes into Pack Trail mode?

Regarding the ROAD(FR401): We did a 4x4 scouting trip on 11/12 in my highly modified Jeep with a 7" lift, 35x12.50 BFG All Terrains aired down to 15psi, and fully-locked front and back with 488x1 diff gearing. For the last 6.2ml section of this 11ml FR401 to Cane Springs TH it took us 2.5 hrs to 4x4 in and took ~3.0hrs to 4x4 out and this amount of time was for just one very capable vehicle having no issues come up and not with a group of various vehicles going in and coming out. A 4x4 like mine is not required to safely make this trip in and out, but I would suggest at a minimum a 4x4 vehicle with a front tow hook(and rear hook-receiver/tow strap/good spare tire), with 31"x10.50" or P265x10" tires with the understanding that street tires are going to take a real beating on this road...it will be slow going in and slower coming out.. IT WILL BE A BLAST & FOR SURE A VERY MEMORABLE 4x4 and HIKE!!

I'm going to commit to this one as soon as I know there will be room... I know there aren't many drivers yet and my Tacoma won't make it, so I'm interested for now.

pickelltree wrote:

te-wa wrote:if that is a typical road, i should have no trouble with it. montero has limited slip rear w/ 32's on a 2" lift
im on the interested list for now..

i have seen the montero struggle, make sure you bring a tow strap

Or just buy a jeep

pickelltree wrote:i have seen the montero struggle, make sure you bring a tow strap

you saw the montero stuggle while in 2 wheel drive on the Tortilla rd.
any vehicle in 2wd would struggle. get your facts straight homie

ya, but when you say it like that it is not as funny,

tewa, i am almost done with my master program,can't wait to get out with you guys again

Waiting to hear if I have to drive out to CA that day to pick up a Jeep.
If I can go, I'll have seats available

joe bartels wrote:Will probably be looping(if possible) around the lake area in the 10-2 vicinity.

Joe, what are you now thinking regarding meeting location/meeting time for Sun-12/7 and who will be driving what with how many passenger seats available?

K I'm in if you want. I'll bring the tow rope in case I need to be dragged along by the Jeep.

Nice!
skatchkins says he can definitely take three so Steve and I are in and looks like there is room for one more. Still awaiting word back from Aaron, he can hold another if he makes it. Hank is looking to start later and be there if we get into trouble on the gnarly road. We're looking to meet at the four peaks turn off at 4:30am.

Alright, I'm in.

Edit: See post below

Update... Upon further consideration, I've reverted back to "interested", based on the very limited seating and the fact that there were approximately 9 people on the "interested" list long before I even considered this one. I was just lucky enough to sign on late last night after a driver was confirmed. So... Spot is open again! If in a couple days there is another spot, I'm totally in. Looking forward to finally hiking with everybody someday soon.

joe bartels wrote:Hank is looking to start later and be there if we get into trouble on the gnarly road.

Here is my plan for Sunday: I will arrive the Cane Springs TH at ~10am (you guys should have been hiking for ~3hrs by then). I will plan to hike down your route (the Adler TR#82) to end my hike at the old Adams Camp for a late lunch stop, then head back up the Adler TR to its intersection with Long Canyon where I will stop here to await your group arrival. IF I am not at this intersection when you arrive, don't wait there for me. IF you guys or I are running late arriving at this Adler TR/Long Canyon intersection, my plan will be to depart A/R so as to arrive back at the Cane Springs TH before dark.

Your loop hike should make for some great memories/pics and triplogs and then the fun 4x4 out to top off the night!