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Here's a question that has flummoxed me for some time. Does it have an answer? Where does the Mogollon Rim "begin" and "end"? Surely it runs at least to the Sedona area on the west, and to the White Mountains on the east. But just as "The Rim" is defined in more of a conceptual way in between these two areas wherever it happens to be less prominent, so too one would assume it continues perhaps farther west and east before finally and permanently dissolving into neighboring geographic "provinces" and the like. It seems the Mogollon Rim is characterized by its overall linear elevational prominence above the neighboring Transition Zone to the south, as well as forming a portion of the boundary of the Colorado Plateau region. So it is both these things, and never just the latter. Is it continuous within its overall areal extent, or is it fair game to call it a broken feature, appearing wherever the right criteria are met? Again, where does it ultimately end for good, west and east? Can anyone really say?

BobP wrote:He just doesn't know the difference between there and their

Wat due ewe xpect four a teechur

Yes, this was all a ruse to elicit feedback on where a long-distance hiking route encompassing the Mogollon Rim ought to begin and end. Good call, fellas!

That USGS definition - while brilliantly specific - seems awfully limited in scope. I mean, Mogollon Rim appears as a cartographic attribution at least as far east / south as the Bear Wallow Wilderness. And of course the Sedona area, either in name or deed, hosts the Rim and lovingly cudgels it with all manner of praise, pink-colored jeeps, and the like.

A Mogollon Rim Trail isn't my idea but I've taken it on, fleshed it out a bit, and I like what I see. The concept is strong, never mind the flim-flam over definitions. There are, by and large, more than enough trails available to piece a route together without needing to solicit approval to build anything new. The corridor is almost entirely public land, so there are no major hurdles to promoting such a route nor any need for major, high-grade roadwalks to get around private property. Of course, there are the big fires of recent memory to contend with, which will undoubtedly alter the best route options in those areas vs. what others may have first envisioned. The eastern extent of such a walk is where most of the focus has been to this point. I'm focusing on the western end. More details will be forthcoming at some point. The gist of it, though, is to start and end this thing at the point where both the Rim and the trail networks that exist *because* of the Rim-type scenery both begin to wane. And then find the nearest town that best serves access and call it the spiritual terminus. So, Williams AZ to Reserve or Alma NM. That's about where the Mogollon Rim ends when considered as a recreational resource. Thoughts? Opinions? I don't wanna get into the nitty gritty of which trails, which precise alignment, etc. There are a bazillion options and thanks to HAZ many are easily researched and tracked. So I'm happy to keep this thread on the scope of the Rim as a recreational resource, or let it go entirely, then pick it up at a later date.

@BobP
Oh no, I know the difference, I guess I just wasn't aware that on a forum page where participants regularly replace punctuation marks with smiley faces and other emoticons to express their feelings that grammar and spelling were placed at such a high premium.

friendofThundergod wrote:I just wasn't aware that on a forum page where participants regularly replace punctuation marks with smiley faces and other emoticons to express their feelings that grammar and spelling were placed at such a high premium.

For most people it isn't. But for people who teech our skrool childrens it is.

blisterfree wrote: Thoughts? Opinions? I don't wanna get into the nitty gritty of which trails, which precise alignment, etc. There are a bazillion options and thanks to HAZ many are easily researched and tracked.

It's as good an excuse as any to go hiking. I am kind of curious about how it would traverse or skirt the Res.

Jason Cleghorn wrote:@chumley

Your post above is why I love HAZ. People that are as passionate about knowing 'things' and explaining them to others as I, about subjects arcane enough to be considered slightly nerdy, but not so nerdy that you're an outcast! LMAO.

Please don't feed the bears, Jason

friendofThundergod wrote:Oh know, I no the difference,

Fixed it for you.

BTW- The Rim is defined by Forest road 300 and that's it and nothing else.

@chumley
Well if you want I could start spot checking triplogs and forum posts for: correct subject verb agreements, sentence fragments, run-ons, subordinate clauses, punctuation and proper usage of prepositional phrases. However, something tells me that would put me somewhere between you and ---- on the HAZ popularity scale ;)

blisterfree wrote:Yes, this was all a ruse to elicit feedback on where a long-distance hiking route encompassing the Mogollon Rim ought to begin and end.

I think it's an awesome idea. What's amusing is the "crown jewel" of the Mogollon Rim is that section defined by the USGS, especially west of Canyon Creek, and features the worst of trails. Up on the rim, the General Crook is virtually impossible to follow and features the joys of dust from motorized traffic on FR300, while just below the rim, the Highline is not generally noted for pleasant hiking experiences.

In my opinion though, a MRT would open up a very unique challenge for some ... the Arizona-Mogollon-Enchantment Trifecta! A long-distance loop hike encompassing the central portion of the AZT (19-27), the western portion of the GET (2-20), and presumably the eastern portion of the MRT.

If the MRT takes a more western route than the AZT toward Williams (through Sedona?) then an even longer loop could be made connecting the western end of the MRT back to the AZT north of the peaks (34).

The shorter loop with the northern point in the General Springs area would likely be 600-800 miles, and a loop that includes Williams and AZT 19-34 would probably be over 1000 miles. The lowest elevations would be the short stretches of the GET on either side of the Pinalenos, with the rest of it being reasonably high up.

@chumley

while just below the rim, the Highline is not generally noted for pleasant hiking experiences.

I'm somewhat aware, somewhat in the dark. How does the rest of the Highline differ from the Arizona Trail portion? Any recent fires or major log rolling contests to endure?

large doses of repetitive ravine contouring wears on the psyche

What's wrong with the Highline? I've rarely encountered groups of 15 ;)

@joe bartels
More ravines, fewer people

@BobP
I'm calling the moderator! :tt:

@friendofThundergod

chumley wrote:General Crook is virtually impossible to follow and features the joys of dust from motorized traffic on FR300

The General Crook is not that hard to follow.
There are 2 short sections around the area of the Rim Road and three other short sections come to mind.
While the trail is on FR300 a for sections where it didn't have much of a choice, it does a great job of sampling the forest, tanks and springs, for much of it's track up there.
My vote for a RIM trail, would be to have the track up on the RIM.

Mogollon Rim Trail (tm) ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ps10gHXyO0k

@blisterfree
I am torn between commenting on the attractiveness of the woman in video or pushing her annoying off the Mogollon Rim

joe bartels wrote:large doses of repetitive ravine contouring wears on the psyche

Can you say Tonto Trail?

@friendofThundergod
Aw she would be eternally more tolerable without the TRACKS guy flapping his yapper the whole time!